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05-08 07:29

Maggie Murder

4119

Canada - USR

To be in love for an hour is worth the weight of a hundred years lacking it. And at the end, nothing. Death, which is worth a single kiss.

The Pet Association

What I find annoying and consider chatspeak is:
"0mgz h1 1 r 4w3sum 4nd gr8 le+z b fr13ndz!"


Now,that, my good friend, is chatspeak.
I grew up on neopets, where chatspeak has run wild for years.
I much preffer someone saying "funneh".
And if youre going to classify cute-speak as chat-speak, the the chatspeak rules should be more enforced. Lol and Omg are chatspeak. So is MOD and PI and SO. So those would also have to go.
You cant really chose the chatspeak we can and cannot use, if youre going to strictly enforce it..


*edit*
Happy happy happy! Page 4 :happy

05-08 15:13

Babystarz

5912

United States - USR

Breeding Mavens Very Boring Grownups The Azuyan Project The Writer's Guild

Hi all, I just wanted to post to say I'm not ignoring the questions in this thread, but considering their volume and complexity, I don't have time at the moment to answer them all. You have all brought up some interesting points that should certainly be addressed. I would like to say one thing though - we don't ban people for slipping up and using chatspeak every once in a while. Bans come when someone has been asked to stop repeatedly and refuses to.

05-08 20:41

Becca.:.Marie<3

1327

Canada - USR

HIII !

The Azuyan Project The Writer's Guild

I'm just a little confused about this, In my opinion I don't think it is actully chatspeak it is just the same word just with "eh" on the end just like "ing" on the end of a word. Again this is just what I myself think. (Please don't get angry with what I think!) But I am glad their is no more chat speak on PI, because I find that mostly some TRI's use this in use of chat speak:

I luv the s8ng sk8 er boi! It rox my sox! lol I'm funne! (Not exactly this sentance but I think you get my point right?)

~Peace

~Autumn
I be Becca . I used to be .:Hot Pink Nerd:. ! But I decided to change it ! :smile

05-08 23:18

vivianes

1407

Brazil - USR

Main account

The Writer's Guild The Azuyan Project Very Boring Grownups


hmmm ... News Forum please? I think this is my first time in Friends Forum ... I even feel strange being here ... What of all the other people who post elsewhere? Is this a Friends Forum-only rule? We use a lot of cutie words in Adoptables General!
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05-08 23:35

BlackCat

3213

United States - USR

Doldrums Initiative WPAG The Azuyan Project Very Boring Grownups

Quote :

Lol and Omg are chatspeak. So is MOD and PI and SO. So those would also have to go.



LOL = Laugh Out Loud
OMG = Oh My God

Like I said earlier, they are acronyms and not chatspeak. Chatspeak is "to use the fewest number of characters needed to convey a comprehensible message. Hence, punctuation and grammar are largely ignored," while an acronym is "a word formed from the initial letters or groups of letters of words in a set phrase or series of words". They are not the same.

(Definitions are from "Reference.com" and "Dictionary.com")
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05-09 00:38

DemonicSymphony

93

United States - USR

Very Boring Grownups

Ok... I'm dyslexic and have a hard time realizing when I typo things like teh/the. They look the same to me most of the time due to the dyslexia.

So... I can be banned for being disabled now?

05-09 00:39

AmandaPanda

2216

United States - USR

<3 I am a panda who loves a raccoon .

Very Boring Grownups The Azuyan Project

I'm a bit concerned with all of this .

05-09 01:08

USR Deleted

1

-

i think some people can show you how to get some where

05-09 01:37

FrostFlower

3707

United States - USR

The Azuyan Project Very Boring Grownups

Acronyms are not chatspeak. Not every shortening of words is chatspeak--contractions shorten words as well, but nobody's saying we should be allowed to say "FrostFlower ish having a sale, ponehs in mah nursery 4 u plz look!" because we can say "can't" or "DVSO." Comparing the two is honestly a bit silly, in my opinion.

As far as whether or not "eh" words are chatspeak...well, technically, maybe not. But I would contend that excessive use of them is still a violation of a rule of the site: Write in clear English. Using "cutespeak" in all of your posts is not clear English. Spelling errors, roleplaying where you're trying to show dialect, the occasional offhanded comment or silly post--that's one thing. Typing in baby talk all the time is another.
imgimg

05-09 01:59

Indie

10047

United States - MOD

MOD Status: ACTIVE

Triple Visible - TV Very Boring Grownups Sweet as Can Be Breeding Mavens POTW WUA Doldrums Initiative WPAG The Writer's Guild The Azuyan Project The Pet Association

I really feel that arguing whether or not these rules are chatspeak is a moot point. Either way, using them is against PI rules, to quote the Manual:

Quote :


b. PonyIsland's official language is English. Please write in clear, proper English.



I don't really think anyone can argue that words ending in "eh" such as "poneh" or "meh" are clear, proper English, which the rules of the site require when it comes to talking in the forums. So even if it isn't technically chatspeak, it is not allowed for the same reason that chatspeak is not allowed: it makes a sentence hard to understand and follow.

05-09 02:25

Babystarz

5916

United States - USR

Very Boring Grownups The Azuyan Project Breeding Mavens The Writer's Guild

Quote :

So... I can be banned for being disabled now?



Please point to where I said people doing this would be banned. This keeps coming up, and I don't believe I said anywhere that bans would result, except in this part:

Quote :

I would like to say one thing though - we don't ban people for slipping up and using chatspeak every once in a while. Bans come when someone has been asked to stop repeatedly and refuses to.



We do understand context; we're not robots :smile We can certainly tell the difference between someone posting in chatspeak or if something is an honest mistake, although it's a good idea to use spellcheck in any case.

05-09 02:31

MadMooCow

1451

Australia - USR

Waltzing in the 4th Dimension

The Azuyan Project Very Boring Grownups Doldrums Initiative Azuyan Dev The Writer's Guild

Does this also mean words like "adoptie" "dreamie" and "wishie" are also unacceptable? If so a reminder about this rule (and a little detail as to how far it extends (giving examples of the words which should not be used) should be posted in the news, just to make all of PI aware of it. A lot of people do not frequent the Friends forum so would miss this thread.

Anyway, I love that there's going to be stricter rules about this, because this 'cute speak' really annoys the absolute crap out of me.
img | | imgimg

05-09 13:28

Sekhmet

2211

United States - MOD

MOD status: Active!

Breeding Mavens Very Boring Grownups The Pet Association

So if the rule states that we must write in clear proper English, does that mean people Who Capitalize The First Letter Of Every Word can be reported? or how about those who dont use any punctuation not even a period so when they type it looks like just one long sentence Those, to me, are not examples of "clear proper English", and yet they are all over every board. Those people who try to politely correct the posters violating that rule get told they are being "rude" and "mean" and "so long as you can understand the meaning, it's ok." And since no action is taken to try and enforce the use of clear proper English, it looks like Talking Like This Is Perfectly Acceptable.

Can I report all violations of clear proper English use, then? If we're going to be such sticklers as to start saying "ebil" and "kitteh" are violations as well.

And what about my southern "y'all"? It's no where near proper English, as I define it. Clear proper English is something I'd write a paper in, and I definitely would not use "y'all" in a paper. But, it's a very common and huge part of the dialect where I'm from, and it's not just "typing like how I talk". Literally saying or typing "you all" looks strange and weird to me. So since "y'all" is more a slang word and is not part of the English language (kind of like ain't), will that be a bad word, too?

Honestly, I understand the idea behind this, but there's already so much breaking of that rule already, with nothing being done. Why add more? And yes, this is adding more. The rule only states "clear proper English". You are adding to the list no-no words and dialects. So, you are adding.
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05-09 21:45

PiedCrow

5507

United States - USR

A million of foods

The exceptions and questions that have been brought up regarding this rule are valid ones. Unfortunately, there's no way to draw a line between some chatspeak and too much chatspeak. As I said in a previous reply, I myself will use an odd word now and then in the midst of my ordinary grammar, for the express purpose of *sounding* ridiculous. If someone scolded me for it, I'd probably be a little miffed.

If nothing else, though, what this thread does do is bring to light how different degrees of this behavior can be tolerated. I think even if the official rules of it still need to be fine-tuned, we can all learn a little something about how to behave. You have no idea how many times I've posted a brag, say for an adoptable or a pony or whathaveyou. And I get several nice replies and comments. And then I get a "*drools* OOOOH smexy!!!"

This.......is fine. I see that you approve. But really.......do you have anything more observant to say? Something that I could value a little more? This chatspeak-language-thing that so many people use has become a load of canned phrases that mean absolutely nothing.

On another note, you can't tell me that someone who insists on using "Meh ish..." instead of "I am..." in nearly every statement is using slang, vernacular, or dialect. They're using babytalk. Again...it's not something that MODs and rule police can track as far as "s/he does it all the time!" goes. It's up to one of us to nicely tell each other now and then "It's getting old...let's talk like real people."

I think people are so desperate to put some sort of personalized "voice" into their writing that they get far too carried away.

Idea: Perhaps those who are in favor of something in the rules to encourage better netiquette -- but don't want to resort to censorship and loss of individuality -- might write down the rule the way they think it should read. Examples are the best food for a hungry discussion ^_^
Welp.

05-09 23:06

Greyjoy

8133

United Kingdom - USR

Sub of Beck as of 2013-01-08.

The Azuyan Project The Writer's Guild

Personally, I do think common "slang" words (such as 'Ya'll' and 'Naw') should be acceptable. I would find it strange that a person who just recently learned english to come onto a site where english is the only language allowed.

And Sekhmet made a really good point.

Quote :

So if the rule states that we must write in clear proper English, does that mean people Who Capitalize The First Letter Of Every Word can be reported? or how about those who dont use any punctuation not even a period so when they type it looks like just one long sentence Those, to me, are not examples of "clear proper English", and yet they are all over every board. Those people who try to politely correct the posters violating that rule get told they are being "rude" and "mean" and "so long as you can understand the meaning, it's ok." And since no action is taken to try and enforce the use of clear proper English, it looks like Talking Like This Is Perfectly Acceptable.



If I were a person whose first language was not English, and had joined PI, I would find people writing without punctuation extremely hard to understand. Also, English is my first language, and I still find some peoples writing a challenge to read!

I know we all sound like a large herd of complainers, but 'slang' is part of how we put a point across to people. If we all wrote in perfect sentences, it would be writing with no emotion, and if any, most likely a confusing one.

Take RPing for instance. Roleplaying is a huge part of PI. Many people are only here for the wonderfull Roleplaying sections PI has. And once people get better at roleplaying, they will get more discriptive. They'll probobly add emotion and a better voice to their character, and doing that may take some slang. If I had a Cowboy Character, he most likely wouldn't talk with a perfectly clear accent, but with some Western accent.

We do not sow.

05-10 00:21

Perfect Eclipse

1156

Australia - USR

Ya face.

WUA The Azuyan Project The Writer's Guild

Would it be okay if for instance, a nickname-
like Ameh?

05-10 05:33

allure

6926

United States - USR

rocketships, dear.

The Writer's Guild The Azuyan Project

Quote :

Quote :

b. PonyIsland's official language is English. Please write in clear, proper English.



I don't really think anyone can argue that words ending in "eh" such as "poneh" or "meh" are clear, proper English, which the rules of the site require when it comes to talking in the forums. So even if it isn't technically chatspeak, it is not allowed for the same reason that chatspeak is not allowed: it makes a sentence hard to understand and follow.



However, I can argue that constant misspellings or Typing Like This For The Entire Post are most certainly not clear, proper English. Are those not allowed now either? I honestly find reading words that end in "-eh" much, much easier than deciphering a post with a lack/abuse of punctuation/capitalization or a ridiculous amount of misspellings.

The other thing is... nobody wants to have their every post read like an English essay. The "-eh" suffix isn't even chatspeak, really--it's more of a dialect, and while it isn't Standard Written English, nobody actually uses Standard Written English on any Internet forum.

My point is that "-eh" is hardly the worst of our troubles. I suggest that you take a step in enforcing proper capitalization, punctuation, and spelling before you start cracking down on trivial things like cutespeak.
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05-10 22:16

Kahlira

23280

United States - USR

Tiger, tiger, burning bright. Tiger, tiger through the night. Wake  up early, rise and shine. Tiger, tiger, ready to fight. Avatar by Chasyn

Very Boring Grownups Into the Woods The Writer's Guild

Ok, I didn't know this existed until today. I get a pretty lecture about using words like "Behbeh" "Yush" and "Teh" which have sort of become my way of typing, since it's how I talk. But now that I know it's wrong I shall stop. But then to have the MOD turn right around and say "Yarp"((Instead of Yeah, or yes)) and "Hey ya,"((Instead of Hey You)) I mean serioulsy? What's wrong with that?

Isn't that a case of the pot calling the kettle black?

I stay away from the friends forum like a plague. It scares me.

I would also like to know, why something of this much import was not placed somewhere more people go, like.. Maybe.. Discussion? I check those forums rather often actually, just the stickied posts. Every once in a while, I'll post in the "Which pony would you steal" thread. But otherwise, Nothing. I stick to the adoptables boards.

05-11 09:59

aggaggg

5878

United Kingdom - USR

On hiatus.

The Azuyan Project The Writer's Guild WPAG

*nods* I find that absoloutley right Kah. ^-^
Many of us Users tend to stay in the Adoptable/RP/FF/Association Boards, and not all of PI actually usually visit this forum.
I'm moreover cooped up in the Adoptable Board, and also, I only use the worlds ending with 'eh with my friends, who use it too and know what it means. Not with anyone else. :love
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The present is un opened. What lies inside is something completely unpredictable, the future.


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]img[url www.freewebs.com/scuttle-ponies]img img img


05-11 17:16

PoniBabi3000

5614

United Kingdom - USR

Looking for something?


;)

The Writer's Guild Very Boring Grownups The Pet Association

Quote :

I only use the worlds ending with 'eh with my friends, who use it too and know what it means. Not with anyone else. <3



*grin* Hello Myst ;D

I'm finding it rather disconcerting actually, now :XD I keep typing things like "funneh" and "Silleh" then realising it is chatspeak and flailing about :XD

05-11 22:24

Summer in Seattle

41

United States - USR

Ordinary with a dash of love

WUA The Azuyan Project Into the Woods WPAG The Writer's Guild

thanks i never knew that ^^
Symmetrical - An Original Fiction by Hope and LookingSinister
As you get older three things happen. The first is your memory goes, and I can't remember the other two...

05-12 22:49

Okami Amaterasu

3471

United States - USR

Wow I did not know that. *Shrugs* I guess I'll have to refrain from using it. Alothough I don't use it that often. I can sacrifice my interests in funny words. -_^

05-13 05:51

Marlyn Sales

228

United States - USR

I realize that is it not needed, but I feel I must add my two pennies worth as well.

I am from the Southwestern US and I am guilty of using words like "heya", "yall", "folks", "ebil" (specifically in reference to plot bunnies), "luff", and "prolly" in addition to a couple more. These are words that I personally have been using all of my adult life (I am 26 years old) and I have no intention of changing this. I'm too hard headed and set in my ways.

Honestly, the only words I wouldn't use when writing a formal paper would be "ebil" and "luff", simply because these are words that I use in conjunction with specific subjects such as showing affection for someone I don't know very well or for something cute (luff) and the writing phenomenon I call plot bunnies (where you have ideas that pop up out of nowhere that try to drag your plot off in random directions) and I rarely have reason to write about those subjects.

In regard to lol, rofl, omg, DVSO, SO, valkie, and the like, who is to say that if we can't use regional terms (like yall or fella) that we should be allowed to use them? Yes, even folks that do not speak English as their native language understand them after just a short time spent on PI, but who is to say that they wouldn't come to understand the other terms as well? I have come to understand what the words kawii and gomen mean over the years I have spent online chatting with friends. True, they are more than just slang, but if we are not allowed to say "ish" should we be allowed to say "kawii" or even "konichiwa"? (Yes, I realize that I prolly spelled that wrong, but I don't feel like pulling out my Japanese-English dictionary at the moment.)

I apologize if this seemed a little off-topic, but it is late here and I only just now noticed this post, seeing as I don't often visit the Friends Forum and I've been absent for more than just feeding my ponies this past week or so.

05-13 19:59

cat_girl

429

United Kingdom - USR

hi!my sister is mysic mosher! if you like warrior cats them pm her!

Quote :

Now,that, my good friend, is chatspeak.
I grew up on neopets, where chatspeak has run wild for years.
I much preffer someone saying "funneh".
And if youre going to classify cute-speak as chat-speak, the the chatspeak rules should be more enforced. Lol and Omg are chatspeak. So is MOD and PI and SO. So those would also have to go.
You cant really chose the chatspeak we can and cannot use, if youre going to strictly enforce it..



Well i partly agree with Maggie Murder but words such as PI and SO and MOD are not chatspeak. They are abreviations(lol sorry can't spell that word i don't think) but lots of MOD's use eh and ish aswell as users. Shouldn't MODs set an example to the Users of PI?All i'm saying is i this in the rules thread in the manual. Oh sorry, no.
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05-14 00:40

Loch Jess Monster

8237

United States - USR

well isn't that special

The Pet Association Into the Woods The Writer's Guild The Azuyan Project Sweet as Can Be

I don't know what I want to say here other than this.
"LOL" and "OMG" and "ROFL" are technically acronyms as well as chatspeak. When you think about it, then acronyms are included in the category of chatspeak. c:
The literate definition of "acronym" is:
n. a word formed from the initial letters or groups of letters of words in a set phrase or series of words
That's shortening a phrase or series of words instead of typing it all out, right?

So, yeah, I just wanted to say that. ^___^
i'm jessica, nice to meet you. (:

05-14 10:22

Talison

961

United States - USR

Glomp!

Miss Luna is absolutely correct in saying that abbreviations like LOL and OMG are acronyms as well as chatspeak. They originated in text messages and instant messages, FCOL! (<-- that's more chatspeak =P) If you read the Wikipedia article about chatspeak (or any of the gazillion other chatspeak guides available on the whole big wide internet), you'll see that acronyms are a big part of chatspeak and always have been. You can find whole huge lists of abbrevations/acronyms that are commonly used in chatspeak.

And by the definition BlackCat quoted, chatspeak is "to use the fewest number of characters needed to convey a comprehensible message." LOL certainly falls under that, because it does use the fewest number of characters needed to convey a comprehensible message. LOL is the fewest number of characters needed to convey the comprehensible message that you're laughing out loud, no? It's certainly a lot shorter than typing the sentence, "I'm laughing out loud!" BRB is the fewest number of characters need to convey the comprehensible message that you'll be right back, and so on. Sorry BlackCat, but you're pwned (more chatspeak... err, actually gamespeak) by your own definition! :tongue

But on a more serious note... I'm concerned, like some of the others who have posted, that the rules are not clear enough on what exactly isn't allowed. "Clear, proper English" is subjective, and allowing some chatspeak (like LOL) while disallowing other chatspeak is rather confusing. I'm clear on "kitteh" not being allowed, and that it's not okay to use all caps, and that I probably shouldn't use numbers to replace whole syllables... but after that it gets a little fuzzy. I'm sure the MODs are already giving thought to that issue, so I'm hopeful that it will get sorted out eventually (and added to the manual as a reference, maybe? Or is that hoping for too much?)
imgimgimgimgimg

05-14 18:57

PiedCrow

5551

United States - USR

A million of foods

Quote :

What I find annoying and consider chatspeak is:
"0mgz h1 1 r 4w3sum 4nd gr8 le+z b fr13ndz!"


Now,that, my good friend, is chatspeak.



Actually, most of that is L33Tspeak, not chatspeak. The letter to number replacement has roots in the gamer/hacker community, and while equally as annoying is very recognizable --- most of my gamer and programmer friends would probably bristle at the comparison.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=l33tspeak

Some of urbandictionary.com's articles are to be taken with a grain of salt, as it's a user-created directory --- though it should be noticed that this is the combined viewpoints of the internet community at large and as such warrants some credence, i.e. the court of public opinion. This article on L33Tspeak is pretty comprehensive, and you can see that it's a fairly well-defined and organized method of communication -- however, there is a place and an environment for it, and PonyIsland is not that environment.

On the same note, if you look up "chatspeak" or "netspeak" on Urbandictionary, you notice several things -- it's defined across the board as an intentional and contrived contraction and omission of spelling rules, grammar rules and punctuation. Also, pretty much everybody hates it. Additionally, dialects, vernacular, "Eh", "y'all" and other regional linguistic traits are protected.

Just trying to help clear up some of the labels.
Welp.

05-15 16:56

.:Okami:.

2816

Ireland - USR

For Sale. Contact Winter Solstice

WUA

Can we say 'Meh' as in 'Meh! I don't relly care for Chatspeakers.' ?
Just wondering.

05-15 18:52

USR Deleted

3

-

i never knew that

05-15 20:53

USR Deleted

41

-

i did not know that thanks for the tip

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